Gino Wickman: Do You Really Have What it Takes to be an Entrepreneur

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How do we know if we really have what it takes to succeed as an entrepreneur? Can anyone do it? In this interview, we talk with entrepreneur and author of the legendary book Traction, Gino Wickman, to find out who should take the leap!

An entrepreneur since the age of 21, Gino has had an obsession for learning what makes businesses and entrepreneurs thrive. At 25 he took over the family business, which was deeply in debt and in need of help. After turning the company around and running it for seven years, he and his partners successfully sold the company. Gino then set out to help entrepreneurs and leaders get what they want from their businesses. Based on his years of real-world experience, he created the Entrepreneurial Operating System (EOS), a practical method for helping companies achieve greatness. He has personally delivered more than 1,900 full-day sessions for more than 135 companies, helping them implement EOS. He is also the author of the award-winning, best-selling book Traction: Get a Grip on Your Business, as well as Get a Grip, Rocket Fuel, How to Be a Great Boss and What the Heck is EOS?. Gino is the founder of EOS Worldwide, an organization that helps thousands of businesses implement EOS with the aid of an international team of over 350 professional and certified EOS Implementers and online support. There are almost 100,000 companies using the EOS tools Worldwide. Gino is now devoting time and energy toward helping entrepreneurs-in-the-making get a huge jump-start on taking their entrepreneurial leap, which is why he created Entrepreneurial Leap.

Learn more about Gino and his work at >  https://www.e-leap.com/

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Transcription of Interview

(Transcribed by Otter.ai, there may be errors)

Adam G. Force 00:03

Welcome to the Change Creator podcast where entrepreneurs come to learn how to live their truth, get rich and make a massive difference in the world. I’m your host Adam forest co founder, Change Creator and co creator of the captivate method. Each week we talk to experts about leadership, digital marketing and sales strategies that you can implement in your business and like to go big visit us at Change Creator comm forward slash growbig to grab awesome resources that will help drive your business forward. What’s up what’s up everybody? This is Adam here. Welcome back to the show. If you missed the last episode, we had the one and only Bob Berry. He is a user experience master working with some of the most established companies around the world. User Experience is so important this is how people interact with your business and your products and how to actually get the most out of it. This translates to sales. This is a call that you don’t want to miss. I would jump in there and check that out. Again, that is with Bob Berry. It’s called mastering user experience to grow your biz. Today we have a legend on our hands. So Bob, not Bob Berry, who I just spoke about No, we’re talking about Gino wickman. So he started as an entrepreneur at the age of 21. And I learned about Gino because I read his book, which is a best selling book that most every entrepreneur I think should should read and it’s called traction Get a grip on your business is all about getting traction. So, you know, as early stage entrepreneurs, or anybody honestly, there’s just great perspective and ideas about getting that traction that we’re all looking for. Now Gino, he created what we call EOS, the entrepreneurial operating system. And this is a solution that helps companies achieve greatness, right. So he’s actually delivered the strategies methodology to over 1900 through over 1900 full day sessions right to over 135 companies and now he is the founder of EOS worldwide, which is an organization that’s helping thousands of businesses implement the same strategies. And it has a team of over 350 professionals who are certified in that methodology. And there’s almost, I guess, 100,000 companies using the tools, the EOS tools around the world. So he’s devoted all his time and energy towards helping entrepreneurs make a big difference in jumpstart their businesses. And he created this book called entrepreneurial leap. This is his next big thing. And we’re going to talk about what that’s all about today and why it’s important and really pick his brain on some of the strategies based on all these years of experience and working with all these companies and implementing all these, this methodology that he has called Eos. Alright guys, let’s dive into this conversation with Gino.

Gino Wickman 02:44

Okay, show me the heat.

Adam G. Force 02:48

Hey Gino, welcome to the Change Creator podcast show. How’s everything going, man?

Gino Wickman 02:53

It is going great. Happy to be with you Adam.

Adam G. Force 02:56

Yeah, appreciate appreciate you taking the time. I know you’re busy guy and You know, I did. I’m one of the avid readers of that book traction that you have. And I’m excited about your new book, the entrepreneurial leap, I think this could be really a good one for our listeners to dig into. So thanks for being here to talk about it and kind of sharing some of those insights and stuff like that. If you could just share maybe a little bit of background like, just let people give that give you that bird’s eye view of your background for those that don’t know, traction and EOS like really, in a nutshell, and then how you got to transition into this new book.

Gino Wickman 03:32

Yeah, happy to so the quick entrepreneurial journey is that I’ve been an entrepreneur since 2001, took over a family business at 25, did a big turn around, grew it, sold it and then set off to pursue what I really discovered is my calling and that’s helping entrepreneurs and so I created a system called Eos. I’ve written five books around it traction being the kind of epicenter of all the books that explains Eos. Those books have sold over a million copies. We have over 100,000 companies running on that system using that system. And I built an organization with my partner Don tinny called EOS worldwide that now has 375 EOS implementers. All over the world, helping companies with that system sold that business two years ago, still on 12 and a half percent still the EOS guy still on the books, still doing talks, still have clients, all that good stuff. But taking us to where we are in for this podcast. It was about 12 years ago when I was 40 years old. And I said when I turned 50, I’m going to shift my energy. And I’m going to go to the front end of the entrepreneurial journey, and I’m going to help entrepreneurs in the making, get a huge jump on taking their entrepreneurial leap. And so after almost three decades of helping entrepreneurs, you know, I feel like I’ve dialed in the genetic code in and what this book is all about entrepreneurial leap is doing exactly that what I’m actually doing is teaching and helping my 18 year old self and so there’s an old saying That says we teach what we needed the most. And I’m basically teaching my 18 year old self. Because if I knew what I put in this book and what I’m teaching the world now, when I was 18, I would have literally had an 11 year jumpstart, because it was around age 29, that I really realized that I was an entrepreneur, and then capitalized on that. So that’s the fastest version of the story.

Adam G. Force 05:23

I love it. Thank you. And I’m curious, just that last part, what what made you realize that you were an entrepreneur when you’re 29, what happened?

Gino Wickman 05:33

It was an intersection of a whole bunch of data points. And so I had done the family turnaround. I was getting a little bored with that, because that was running and growing it. I was in a program called the Strategic Coach with Dan Sullivan. I was in an organization called ye oh now known as EO the entrepreneurs organization. And, and it was all of those intersecting points being surrounded by entrepreneurs, and I really realize, you know that there was a light bulb moment that just, you know, helped me see that I am a wild and crazy entrepreneur. And, and then I also really realized my calling, which is this gift that I have for helping entrepreneurs. And so I took an entrepreneurial leap, we sold the business, I then took an entrepreneurial leap and built a business around what I really realized that I was here to do. Hmm.

Adam G. Force 06:25

It’s interesting, cuz I noticed in you know, the early part of your new book, he talks about how you either are or you are not born with it and saying entrepreneurship is nature, not nurture. And I kind of want to just talk about that a little bit, because I’ve had, I’ve had mixed perspectives around that meaning Some people say everyone’s an entrepreneur, and you’re saying something a little different. So I would love to hear your perspective on that.

Gino Wickman 06:52

Yeah, for sure. And it’s a great debate. So I really urge you to, you know, voice your strong opinions, because we may not agree and I think that’s the best thing we can do for your audience is for them to hear the contrast, of course, and I’m really excited about your audience because you know, you and I were talking to, you know, entrepreneurs and entrepreneurs in the makings, and so they’ll totally get this. And they’ll form their own opinion. But you know, very directly very strongly. I believe a true entrepreneur has six essential traits. And we can talk about those if you want to get into that next but but I believe they have six essential traits. And this is 30 years of history working with thousands of entrepreneurs. And not only that, I believe you are born with them. I don’t believe these traits can be taught you can’t teach a trait you can teach skills, but I believe you’re born with them. And so it’s truly nature over nurture. And so assuming all that is true, I want to I’d love to hear your response to that. But I want to create a context for your audience because this will really help them see in their mind, exactly what we’re talking about. Because if you picture an arc, I teach something called the entre General range. And what the entrepreneurial ranges is, this is where all self employed people reside. This is where all people that own their own business reside in. So if you picture the far right side of the range, picture the words true entrepreneur, and if you picture the far left side of the range picture, self employed people. And so on the right side, true entrepreneurs, the far right side are the greatest entrepreneurs of all time, Henry Ford, Walt Disney, Steve Jobs, Oprah Winfrey, Sara Blakely, on the far left side, are all of the one person shows people with a side hustle consultants, things like that. And so with every self employed person, everyone with a business falls somewhere on that spectrum on that range. And when I say true entrepreneur, the people with these six essential traits, I’m talking about the people on the right half of the rain, the people that go out and build organizations with people and so you know, everyone Listening is somewhere on that range if they’re all self employed entrepreneurs. And then the last little point is that I really feel like I’m doing a service to the world because right now everyone wants to be an entrepreneur. Just like in the 70s. Everyone wanted to be a rock star. And with all due love and respect, not everyone was cut out to be a rock star. And not everyone is cut out to be an entrepreneur. And listen, it’s not all it’s cracked up to be true entrepreneurs are borderline crazy in some really freakin hard and get your ass kicked on a daily basis. And it’s not, you know, all it’s cracked up to be. So there’s my jumping off point for you.

Adam G. Force 09:39

Yeah, I love it. I mean, no, I totally get where you’re coming from. And maybe for some people, it would start with defining exactly what we mean by entrepreneur, right? Because I think some people might have different definitions of that as well. And you know, you’re talking about some of the greats and the largest organizations in the world and then the self employed person Who is, you know, making a living on their own, but they’re not building large teams at scale. So I like the idea of this range. And I think you know, for me, I guess in my perspective, you know, I had a conversation with Muhammad Yunus. I don’t know if you know who he is, he’s like, I see that. Okay, so he’s a Nobel Peace Prize winner in the space of social entrepreneurship. And he started Grameen Bank and all this stuff. And I had a conversation with him and he believed that you know, everybody’s an entrepreneur. And I think it comes down to these definitions and how we’re looking at it. And when you talk about some of these essential traits, you know, being a risk taker a problem solver. I start to wonder well, what how did somebody grow up? What did they learn and it does this become a a effect of human behavior and conditioning? To make them the kind of person they are right so they’re not skills but they are? subject subconscious behaviors, right. So can those things be changed? If somebody actually wants to change it, right?

Gino Wickman 11:03

Yeah, love it. And so like, I’ll give you another couple thoughts and then indirectly answer your question because, you know, I know a lot of your audience out there, you know, they consider themselves entrepreneurs, but they’re one person shows and the first point I want to make is that is absolutely admirable, respectable, you’re still taking a risk. And I just consider you to be a business owner, I consider you to be self employed in that case. And so to hold that thought for a minute, I always use a just a really kind of raw example. And that is, you know, somebody with handy skills can become a handyman or a handy woman charge 60 bucks an hour, make 100 grand a year and go do what they love. And if they’re good at it, and they do a good job, they’ll get referred and they will be busy for the next 25 years of their life making 100 grand a year and that is so admirable, and then you and I could give 1000 examples Have a business one person could go into and do and obviously, your audience has a lot of that. The point I’m making is, I just don’t consider that to be a true entrepreneur. And you’re right. It’s definitional. This is just my definition. So yeah, don’t get don’t get pissed off at me. I’m talking to your audience. But, but that’s just my definition. The point I’m making now is someone with these six essential traits, they can’t help themselves. But to turn that into a business. It turned that into an organization, grow it and start bringing on people and so that handyman that has the six essential traits is going to spend a year doing that work and then realize, holy cow, if I hire someone else, you know, I can elevate myself and someone else and someone else and all the sudden they’ve got a construction company, the person that cuts a lawn cuts 20 lawns, 30 lawns realizes, wow, I hire somebody to cut those 30 lawns and go cut 30 more. They can’t help themselves but to build an organization This is a cautionary tale because so many people I’ve talked to, you have people in your audience right now, they just need to remain a one person show and make their hundred 200 300 400 grand a year and that is admirable. And there’s actually there’s a piece that will come over them once they realize they probably don’t have all of these traits. But for the ones that do, the idea is now that you know this after reading the first part of the book, which I call confirm, now you clearly know what you are. And I’m going to show you a path in a way that’s going to make your journey much more seamless. you’ll avoid half the mistakes you’re about to make, I can help you get there faster. And I I’m just trying to save the person that goes out and tries to build an organization and they go through 10 years of hell and fail because they really didn’t have what it takes to become a true entrepreneur and be on the far right side of that entrepreneurial range. We talked about God

Adam G. Force 13:56

Yeah, I see where you’re going with it. And it is in that that that realm of growing an organization having, you know, 100 people on your team, I guess, and you’re far more. Right.

Gino Wickman 14:09

Exactly. And then to that same point, having 100 employees is not all it’s cracked up to be, you know, yes, worldwide is over 400 people in that organization. And it is daunting, it’s complex. It requires, you know, a whole different set of skills. And then it prompts another thought, and that is just using me as an example, when I sold the family business, took my entrepreneurial leap. I was actually that one person show for the first five years I was out there as a coach working with entrepreneurs, but again, I couldn’t help myself, but to turn it into an organization again, that now has over 400 people in it. I just couldn’t stop myself and it was a pretty damn good, peaceful life, those five years in the work I was doing, but I was just compelled to keep growing and growing and driving and driving. So anyway,

Adam G. Force 15:00

Yeah, no, I mean, I think that all makes sense. And it sounds like you know, for a lot of people, you have to really be honest with yourself and what you want, right? So, you know, some do you want to have 400 employees and all the complexities and everything that comes with it, right? Because there comes a different responsibility and different pressures and stresses and things like that. And if you have a team of one to five people, but you’re making a million dollars a year, that’s a very different dynamic as well. So I guess it comes down to what somebody really wants out of their life.

Gino Wickman 15:32

Yeah. And that you know, and so you just perfectly teed up part two of the book because once you finish with part one, there’s an assessment you take, you ultimately get a score. That assessment is available on the website, free and downloadable E dash leap calm but once you confirm that you have the six essential traits, and you’re a true entrepreneur. The next part of the book is called glimpse and then I spent the next third of the book showing that potential entrepreneur a glimpse of what as possible in the world for an entrepreneur and more importantly, what all the options are. And so to your exact point, I created this tool called my biz match. And what I’m teaching in this part and leading to this tool is to help that entrepreneur out there listening to understand all of your options, because there are so many more options to being an entrepreneur than just a billion dollar tech, unicorn entrepreneur. I mean that that’s one in a million, and it’s not for everyone. And so what I teach and talk about are all of the industries available out there. And then I talk about the types of companies because there’s three factors when it comes to type of company. It’s Are you a product service or a business service? Are you a product business or a service business? Are you b2b or b2c? And are you high price, low volume, low price, high volume, when you start to weigh all of those factors, I believe every entrepreneur is drawn to something and then the third thing you get into is size. Just like what you’re talking about there, because, again, 10,000 employees is not for every entrepreneur, there is no shame in having a $3 million heating and cooling company throwing off a 20% profit with 40 people. In other words there that is respectable, admirable. And so there’s no shame in that. And so with my biz match, you literally just click on a bunch of buttons, answer some questions, and out pops the perfect business for you. And so we’re all built. They’re our product people in this world. They’re our service people in this world, and they rarely meet. And so it’s just trying to learn and understand what you’re drawn to. That’s going to greatly increase your odds of success and keep you doing something you’re totally passionate about.

Adam G. Force 17:42

I love that. Now that sounds pretty cool. And and I think it’s such an important part of the process that a lot of people skip is, you know, simply becoming clear about what you want and what’s going to make sense for you. Because, you know, the way we’ve always looked at it too is if you write down your in your notes or you take a process like yours, Going through here and you see, well, here’s what I want. You may not know what that looks like, or the person that you actually need to become to get there, right? So I always looked at it as a way to start getting clear on something. And if you have a book like this, and you’ve been down this road, then like, it’s really hard for an entrepreneur to say, Well, I do have that drive and vision and I want to have, you know, 400 employees also, but they don’t know what that business looks like. And it’s really hard to create something when you don’t know what it looks like.

Gino Wickman 18:32

Yeah, and it’s exactly what I do and why I wrote this second part of the book is to create that glimpse, because in my mind, you know, I picture this word entrepreneurship, and that potential entrepreneur listening as this big block of marble and and in there is the sculpture in there is that person so I always I describe it as helping them to see the light and then see their light and so the light is understated. This whole context of being an entrepreneur, their light is then seeing where they fit in that entrepreneurial world. And so I’m quite proud of how powerful it is. Because by the end of glimpse, you had this vivid picture of what the perfect business is for you what the life looks like both Heaven and Hell, how to avoid the eight mistakes that every entrepreneur makes when they take their leap. And I also give countless stories of entrepreneurs who were right where you are, and and what they did to grow to what they grew to. And then from there, we go to the third part of the book, which is path and then I show a clear path for how to greatly increase your odds and eliminate half the mistakes you still will make the other half it’s part of the journey and they’re unavoidable. Hmm,

Adam G. Force 19:49

interesting. So let’s touch a little bit on the three parts in a little more detail. So we did kind of cover off on the range concept and things like that. Let’s just quickly If you don’t mind touch on the some of the essential traits and and why they’re important.

Gino Wickman 20:05

Yeah, you bet. And so at a very high level, I’ll give you all six. It’s visionary, passionate, problem solver, driven, risk taker, and responsible. And so those are the six, you know, in terms of why they’re important. They’re kind of self explanatory, but I can do a really quick, you know, one or two minute riff that paints a vivid color of all six if you’d like me to, but at a high level, those are the six and they’re all vital. And so I get asked, Well, what if you don’t have one or two? Well, here’s the answer. If you don’t have one or two, you’re probably not a true entrepreneur. And it’s a great awareness, but they’re all vital. Mm hmm.

Adam G. Force 20:47

Interesting. And I like the responsible one because you see a lot of leaders today that blame everyone but themselves so to see a leader who can blame no one and you know, really Look in the mirror and and be that kind of a leader I think is really important in the kind of leadership it takes to build these big companies, right?

Gino Wickman 21:08

Yeah, here, here. And I’ll do a little 32nd riff on that one, because that’s one of my favorites. So people are always shocked when they’re hearing this list, and I get through the first five. And those all make sense. And all of a sudden they hear response, I’m gonna go, Whoa, how is that on the list? It is so vital. And, and so here’s how I know that you’re born with it. Here’s how I know that it’s nature over nurture. And that is, you can put the entire world in one of two categories. There are people that take responsibility when something bad happens. And there are people that blame everyone else. When something happens, they take no responsibility. And the reality of it is you will have a household with four kids, four siblings in the same household and as you’re listening out there, you’re putting all the people in your life and these two categories because it’s so obvious, but if you think about a family with four siblings, you literally will put those siblings in one of two play one of those two buckets? Because how on earth is it possible that those four kids because you out there listening Think of your brothers and your sisters, it’s very obvious how could they grew up in the same household by the same parents same raising same teaching same everything. And yet, half of them end up taking responsibility half don’t you’re born with it its nature over nurture. And responsible means this it means that you blame no one. It means that when something goes wrong, you default to looking in the mirror. You don’t look at who to point to. You take total responsibility for the outcome. You don’t believe in entitlement. And I had a friend that said it so well in a sentence that he said somebody who’s truly responsible when they’re building gets hit by a meteor, they believe it’s their fault. In other words, you chose the building, you built the building you chose to be there and so that’s the essence of responsible and I would also say you know, both are a psychology disorder, there are people that take too much responsibility. People don’t take enough. Both are psychological disorders. I’m not saying it’s healthy for those of us that take responsibility for everything because we carry such a burden. All I’m saying is, it is a trait of a true entrepreneur. And if you don’t have it, you’re just not going to be a successful entrepreneur.

Adam G. Force 23:20

Yeah, I love that. That’s, that’s one of my favorites on the list there too. And I think let’s just jump over to a glimpse, he talked about some of the critical mistakes. I think people listening would like to hear, you know, what are some of these critical mistakes that you’ve come across? Working with a lot of different clients and all the different experiences that you’ve had that really stand out here that might be interesting to talk about?

Gino Wickman 23:42

Yeah, I would love to. And so contextually the point here as I go into these eight is, I paint a vivid picture for that potential entrepreneur of what a day in the life of an entrepreneur looks like. And so you shoot out 10 years from now and picture one of these two scenarios. And so I paint both the dream And the nightmare. And the point and that is I’m showing them how to live the dream. I’m also showing them how they create their own nightmare. And there are eight mistakes that almost every entrepreneur makes when they take their entrepreneurial leap that put them in the nightmare. And so I’m going to go through each of them very quickly. And I would love it you know, you know your audience better than I do. If you’ll just kind of pick the top two to you that you think they would like we can drill down on that, but here are the eight very quickly, number one, not having a vision. Number two, hiring the wrong people. Number three, not spending time with your people. Number four, not knowing who your customer is. Number five, not charging enough. Number six, not staying true to your core. Number seven, not knowing your numbers. And number eight not crystallizing roles and responsibilities.

Adam G. Force 24:50

Yeah, it’s great list. There’s two that I can pull out for our listeners. And I think the two would be actually there’s three but I’m going to call So let’s do not knowing who your customer is, and not knowing your numbers, I think those are two major mistakes that whether they realize it or not, those are the mistakes that are happening.

Gino Wickman 25:10

You’re here. And so the classic mistake here is and for what this is worth, you know, in everything that I write, there’s not one ounce of theory, this comes from the real world. This comes from my three decades. And so this is based on the hundreds, if not thousands, of clients that have come to me and us. And these are the issues they’re facing with us, when they’re at 10 to 250 employees, and these are the mistakes they made. And we’re basically fixing all of those mistakes. And so not knowing who your customer is. The issue there is, is you’re taking this buckshot approach to the world, you know, you’re selling your wares, you’re selling your service, you’re selling your product, and you’re just kind of selling it to everyone. And it’s diluted and it’s murky. And so the idea the way that you saw that is you take a big step back and you get clear on the demographic geographic psychographic of your ideal customer. Who are they? Where are they? What are their? What are they? And to the degree you can get abundantly clear, that’s going to really focus your marketing energy, resources, dollars to greatly increase your sales because now you know who your ideal customer is. You’re speaking their language, you’re using their colors, you’re using their verbiage, and you’re attracting more customers. And so typically when that entrepreneur takes that leap, again, they’re just casting this wide net and and selling very little.

Adam G. Force 26:30

Yeah, yeah, love to hear it and keep reinforcing that for everybody.

Gino Wickman 26:34

Yeah, and then going to not knowing your numbers, that the downside of having the six essential traits almost always is true entrepreneurs, wild and crazy visionary entrepreneurs typically are not good with the numbers. I can still barely read a p&l, quite frankly. But they’re just not great with numbers. And so with that, they’re unfortunately flying blind. They’re always going with their gut. It’s chaotic, and they Not maximizing the profits, they’re not maximizing the growth. And so three simple solutions here, implement a weekly system where you’re looking at the five to 15 most important weekly activity based numbers. Number two, implement a monthly p&l look at a monthly p&l and number three, manage a monthly budget. Even if you don’t know what the heck those three things are, and you just do them by default, you will be forced to learn it in the next two months, you’ll become an expert. So implement those weekly numbers. Look at a monthly p&l manage a monthly budget, and you’ll be an expert within two months, if not a year.

Adam G. Force 27:39

Yeah, it’s so important and it’s a hard lesson that we’ve learned because I’m not somebody that I mean, I like the numbers but I’m not one that’s pulling it together and organized around it. I get like I just want to keep doing other things in the business and growing and stuff. And, you know, I’ve learned the hard way that what you don’t measure doesn’t grow. So keeping an eye on Those things and the most important things is going to be key to growth. Otherwise, you’re just kind of like, you know, floundering a bit

Gino Wickman 28:07

here here and I, you know, one last little point on so I call it a scorecard five to 15 numbers. I learned it from my business mentor when I was 25 years old. He taught me the concept of scorecard. I ran my first business on 14 weekly numbers, ran my second business on 14 weekly numbers. And what it does for you is it literally helps you predict the future because you what you do is you’re looking at those weekly numbers, you want to look at 13 weeks at a glance. So you’re able to see patterns and trends and you can literally predict outcomes three months from now, if you’ll work from a weekly scorecard. So I urge each and every one of your listeners listeners that implement that this week.

Adam G. Force 28:43

Yeah, absolutely. Really good advice. I love that. And why don’t we wrap up on one last part here in the path because I think this is important for people. I mean, everybody in our audience is acting based on their passion, they want to do something meaningful. So what I want to touch on here as you talk about the importance of having a mentor, you know, we have our program, the captivate method where we put storytelling at the heart of their marketing. It’s very authentic, we get consistent sales. And so this is like a group coaching experience. And, you know, a lot of times I feel like people will say, you know, I’m not ready for this or that, and they have this fear that holds them back, right, or perfectionism and things like that. So I would love to hear your thoughts on why it’s so important to have a mentor.

Gino Wickman 29:25

Yeah, that’s a great question. And I’ll share a couple things there. First is I’m going to talk through the pure mentor relationship and the process for finding one and then I’ll go to the second point, but the idea here is for you to find someone out there who is where you want to be. And, and rule of thumb, you’re going to need five to 10 names because you’re going to hear a lot of nose but you reach out to those people and meet with them for an hour. Ask them what you’re looking for. They share their stories and their insights. You share your story and at the end of that if it feels right, you decide to move forward. You agree on a structure. And so I met with my business mentor every month, hour and a half for literally five years. And he taught me so much. And so that’s the mentoring relationship and about 60% of all of the entrepreneurs that I’ve worked with my research, the ones I’ve talked to have had a mentor. And so the point here is if you don’t have a mentor, it’s not a death sentence, you’re going to be fine. But having a mentor is like a speed pass, you really can jump ahead with a mentor. Yeah. Second point, however, is the world is different now. You know, when I was 25, almost 30 years ago and was I was with my business mentor mentoring the last 2030 4050 years was a one on one relationship. And and it there was no money exchanging hands while the world has changed today, with coaching and masterminds and these organizations, there’s a lot of paid mentoring going on, you know, frankly, I’m a paid mentor for my clients. Yeah. And so, so it’s a little different. Now. The reality of it is you can still very much Find a free mentor and I would urge you to do that but but through the incredible amount of education and wisdom and how easy it is to access and in the the kinds of things that you offer entrepreneurs, you know, I’ve had my paid mentor has been Dan Sullivan for 23 years, I’ve been flying to Chicago every 90 days, I pay a lot of money to be around that man because I learned so much. So I’ve had free mentors, paid mentors, you just ultimately have to find someone who’s where you want to be and attach yourself to them some way shape or form. Love it.

Adam G. Force 31:36

Alright, Gina, I really appreciate your time today. We’re gonna close out here. Let’s make sure people know where do they reach you to learn more, find the book, maybe your website, wherever you want to point them here.

Gino Wickman 31:47

You bet. So the epicenter for all things entrepreneurial leap and everything we’ve been talking about is eat, sleep calm. The book is available entrepreneurial leap is the book. It’s available through all major Retailers but you can get to it through the website again E dash leap calm and then you’re also going to find a ton of free resources. There are nine free tools all intended to help you confirm that you’re an entrepreneur in the making and take a much better successful leap. Love it.

Adam G. Force 32:17

Thank you so much for your time today Gino,

Gino Wickman 32:20

my pleasure Adam had a blast.

Adam G. Force 32:22

Thanks for tuning into the Change Creator podcast visit us at Change Creator comm forward slash go big to get access to free downloads and other great resources that will drive your business forward.

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